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OP WTL III AAR 2017
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TOPIC: OP WTL III AAR 2017

OP WTL III AAR 2017 2 years, 1 month ago #1

  • Napster
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  • Have Fun! It's mandatory.
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Hey guys, sorry for the late response, I got pretty sick sleeping the night before, was not properly prepared to caomp out.


Sustains / What went well

- Players appreciated the option to camp out
- Field was clean of hazards
- Players picked up after themselves
- Players were engaged in the scenario
- Team leaders were easy to reach throughout the game to assign objectives and keep the players engaged.
- The cocaine props were some good stuff
- Nobody tried to consume the "cocaine".
- We had a very diverse group of players and a good amount of out-of-town players, and first-time players. This is great for the sport, great for Nitehawk Field, and great for EWA. We're growing.
- The raffle prizes were awesome. Dale gave away BBs, green gas, and two AEGs. Since a large number of players lost their tags, new raffle tickets were issued to those who stayed until the end.
- The nerf rocket launchers added an interesting dynamic to the game.
- Lunch was served efficiently, team leaders took extra water to their bases as I asked, no heat injuries despite a large number of players.
- For the most part, players had a fun day of airsoft.



To Improve

1) Profanity. This is perhaps the most use of profanity I've heard at an airsoft event in 13 years of playing airsoft, granted, it was a large event. I've seen players play as young as 8, and as old as.... never-mind, I won't put a fellow admin on the spot . You may be used to dropping the F-word every other word when you speak with some of your friends, but it does not make a friendly environment or entice players to bring their friends or kids.

2) Interruptions at the briefing. This is something that was not nearly as large of an issue at WTL I and II, and was surprised to see the extent that it was at WTL III. I am going to speak to both Dale and Larry (field owners) about supporting a one-warning policy, second time you are asked to leave the property (with no refund if a fee was paid). If you've heard it 10 or a thousand times, give the people who haven't a chance. Interrupting a briefing you don't want to hear makes it take longer. << Update >> Dale will be implementing the one warning, then you're out policy in regards to interruptions at the safety briefing for all of his future events at Nitehawk Field, effective immediately.

3) Listening to the briefing. Obviously there is a correlation here with interruptions at the briefing. But some players were going back and re-spawning despite a clearly established medic policy as well as a policy for when a medic is not available (whole squad re-spawns together).

4) Radio. If your team is assigned one or more radio channel(s), if you need to use additional channels, let the admins know. For one, admins need a way to reach you, and two, it caused some instances of members of multiple teams on the same channel, which was addressed as prohibited at the briefing.

I will be adding more this week after reviewing some of my notes and speaking with the other admins. Please provide your feedback if you have something constructive to say, the good, the bad, the ugly. If you have suggestions for changing something, I'm all ears, this is the first time we held this event at Nitehawk and we already have a few changes in mind for the next one, I.E. moving spawn locations.


<< Update >>


Things we are considering for next year (not set in stone, feedback wanted)

1) Ramping up the milsim aspect.
Because it is a paid event on private property, with vehicle(s) available, it creates situations that are more easily handled than when we were hosting on state land with no field fee. One of the options, as Nitehawk is also a retailer, is to supply all BBs, and limit the amount of BBs on the field. It would have been fairly complicated to store everybody's BBs and deal with the possibility of people grabbing someone else's bag, but if Nitehawk can provide the BBs (except for snipers), this is something much easier to regulate. However this may incur roughly a $5 increase to the field fee.

In one example, it would look something like this:

Each player (except snipers) starts with ~500 BBs (honestly the number doesn't matter as long as it is consistent, whether it's 500 or 600 etc, we would use an identical small container which fits roughly 500-600 BBs to fill small sandwich bags. Those, we'll say 500 rounds for now are for the player to distribute how he or she wishes, whether over 2 high-caps or 4-5 midcaps for example. Support (LMG) would receive a higher initial BB pool of 2500. During the game, BBs would be rewarded for various things such as CIA-assigned tasks, found in high-traffic areas, or for completion of primary tasks as seen fit by admins, in addition to cocaine rewards. In one example, The CIA may offer a team the mission of neutralizing a rogue agent at a pre-determined location within a certain amount of time before he completes a wireless transmission (actual objective given to Los Burros in WTL III). As reward, in additional to the 5 cocaine, the CIA may give a large container (5,000) to the commanding officer to distribute among his team as he sees fit.

This would promote use of semi-automatic fire (except LMGs, although automatic fire is allowed but discouraged), as well as expose players to the very realistic scenario of having limited ammo and the need to conserve it, as well as put value on acquiring more whether through CIA rewards for missions completed or timed ammo-resupply. Additionally, this would create more depth in comradery in sharing BBs or magazines with teammates, and plays very well into the fact that each team is primarily lead by an established airsoft team from the region. As a side bonus, this would also decrease instances of over-shooting by reducing the volume of fire on the field.


2) Additions to the field
Dale has some building materials and plans on using them to create additional structures on the field, as well as touch up some of the older ones. There will be opportunities to assist in one or more build-days between now and Walk The Line IV in May 2018. There is a possibility in offering a discount for those who come out to help, to be determined by field owner.

3) The reward is in the crate. Rather than making the contents of the shipmate crates out of play, we could put in the exact amount of cocaine as would be the ward for completing it, which can more easily be raided by the DEA or the Halcon Cartel.

4) We are going to establish permanent names for the two cartels. I have been asking the COs to choose their own names, but as we are heading towards a more MILSIM direction with the Walk The Line series, names like Los Burros (The Donkeys) would not be acceptable in future iterations of the event. Furthermore, it makes it easier for admins to refer to the teams when the names don't change every year. Behind the scenes, we have been referring to them as "the big cartel" and "the small cartel".
Sabin
US Navy Veteran



EWA | Webmaster / Admin
Team PRISM | C.O.
-Everyone's favorite computer nerd-
Last Edit: 2 years ago by Napster.
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Re: OP WTL III AAR 2017 2 years, 1 month ago #2

  • toobladink
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  • Enjoy the journey - SG34
  • Posts: 438
To be honest, I did a terrible job at what I was supposed to do.

Mostly because I gave up. The barrel on my sr25 gummed up from elderbb .36, and then my AK wouldn't feed. So for the second half of the day, I took a nap in my car and let Daniel kinda take over. I stayed up late the night before panicking to get someone else's gun finished, which I couldn't, came early for chrono, didn't even show up to chrono for a bit so I could load my mags because I forgot to do it the night before, and I think the only thing that went well for me was being able to smuggle the cocaine.

I definitely want to work on making the briefing better. I've only given a few in my time. I forgot my list thingy when there was the game at the crucible, but I'm impressed everyone stayed quiet for as long as they did. During Siberian Strike, there wasn't as much chatter during the briefing as I thought.

No matter what, I'll be getting a megaphone or a speaker and microphone for the future. I want it to be loud enough so that the players can't their each other when the talk amongst themselves.

I've also been burnt out on airsoft as of late. As much as I hate to say this, but I don't think I'll be playing for a while. I don't plan to go to the game in June at Nitehawk, nor do I plan on playing at D Day in July. Part of me also wishes I just stayed home instead of going to barterwings - my grades reflect my choice with that, and I don't think the tradeoff was worth it.

And so I guess my little personal AAR summary is just that I need to take a little break. Chill on buying guns and focus more on spicing it up for myself. I've already left various Facebook groups so that I get less stuff in my news feed lol.

Overall, when I played in the mornin,g, I thought it was great. The only thing I wish we did was predetermine the channels each team would be allowed to use and post them publicly. And shoutout to Oldarmy for programming my new baofeng radio for me, that helped me a lot!
ASTQA certified tech
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Re: OP WTL III AAR 2017 2 years ago #3

  • Napster
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  • PRISM C.O. / Webmaster / Admin
  • Have Fun! It's mandatory.
  • Posts: 3339
Yeah man, you've been all over the facebook groups and to practically every single event at every single field for some time. The experience might change for you a bit if you take a break from the tech-work and the online posts, and just come out to play a few games without worrying about other people's guns.

I updated my original post to include the sustains.
Sabin
US Navy Veteran



EWA | Webmaster / Admin
Team PRISM | C.O.
-Everyone's favorite computer nerd-
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Re: OP WTL III AAR 2017 2 years ago #4

I didn't notice much cussing from the Los Burros side of things and the game ran pretty smoothly yes sometimes we kick a rock and drop the F-Bomb but that is a normal reaction to a painful situation. lol My only complaint was talking during the breafing but sometimes I'm even guilty of that so I will not complain too much. Only thing I noticed was some not calling hits and the tiny dispute at the end of the day. I'm sure some of that was a misunderstanding and people were getting tired and irritated. For the most part we are a merry bunch.
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Re: OP WTL III AAR 2017 2 years ago #5

  • Nobli
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  • Posts: 7
Napster wrote:
Hey guys, sorry for the late response, I got pretty sick sleeping the night before, was not properly prepared to caomp out.


Sustains / What went well

- Players appreciated the option to camp out
- Field was clean of hazards
- Players picked up after themselves
- Players were engaged in the scenario
- Team leaders were easy to reach throughout the game to assign objectives and keep the players engaged.
- Nobody tried to consume the "cocaine".
- We had a very diverse group of players and a good amount of out-of-town players, and first-time players. This is great for the sport, great for Nitehawk Field, and great for EWA. We're growing.
- The raffle prizes were awesome. Dale gave away BBs, green gas, and two AEGs. Since a large number of players lost their tags, new raffle tickets were issued to those who stayed until the end.
- The nerf rocket launchers added an interesting dynamic to the game.
- Lunch was served efficiently, team leaders took extra water to their bases as I asked, no heat injuries despite a large number of players.
- For the most part, players had a fun day of airsoft.



To Improve

1) Profanity. This is perhaps the most use of profanity I've heard at an airsoft event in 13 years of playing airsoft, granted, it was a large event. I've seen players play as young as 8, and as old as.... never-mind, I won't put a fellow admin on the spot . You may be used to dropping the F-word every other word when you speak with some of your friends, but it does not make a friendly environment or entice players to bring their friends or kids.

2) Interruptions at the briefing. This is something that was not nearly as large of an issue at WTL I and II, and was surprised to see the extent that it was at WTL III. I am going to speak to both Dale and Larry (field owners) about supporting a one-warning policy, second time you are asked to leave the property (with no refund if a fee was paid). If you've heard it 10 or a thousand times, give the people who haven't a chance. Here's a shock: interrupting a briefing you don't want to hear makes it take longer. << Update >> Dale will be implementing the one warning, then you're out policy in regards to interruptions at the safety briefing for all of his future events at Nitehawk Field, effective immediately.

3) Listening to the briefing. Obviously there is a correlation here with interruptions at the briefing. But some players were going back and re-spawning despite a clearly established medic policy as well as a policy for when a medic is not available (whole squad re-spawns together).

4) Radio. If your team is assigned one or more radio channel(s), if you need to use additional channels, let the admins know. For one, admins need a way to reach you, and two, it caused some instances of members of multiple teams on the same channel, which was addressed as prohibited at the briefing.

I will be adding more this week after reviewing some of my notes and speaking with the other admins. Please provide your feedback if you have something constructive to say, the good, the bad, the ugly. If you have suggestions for changing something, I'm all ears, this is the first time we held this event at Nitehawk and we already have a few changes in mind for the next one, I.E. moving spawn locations.



Myself and the people I brought to the match, it was a great first match back since we haven't played with the EWA league in about 5 years. It was a blast for sure, still sore from how much running, diving and dragging people to safety as a medic. Think I revived well over 30 people, spent about as much time restocking bandages as I did using them.

I do want to say something in regards to what you brought up with 2 and 3.

I did see a great deal of interruption but to be fair it wasn't entirely the fault of players. Several times the admins hosting the briefing would take a moment to talk amongst each other about what they were about to say to the crowd next. I don't think its fair to claim they were interrupting when the hosts of the event were not even addressing the crowd as a whole for relatively long spans of time. If you are going to begin punishing by means of expulsion from an event (with threat of not being refunded as well) then I would recommend not placing the beast of that burden on them. You can't expect a group of, what? Nearly 100 players? To just sit there while your briefing is still being figured out. I understand that clarified information is key, so discussing it to make sure the information you give the crowd is as accurate as possible. However, then claiming the crowd of rude interruption when you begin again after just spending several minutes leaving them in silence is not a fair expectation.
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Re: OP WTL III AAR 2017 2 years ago #6

  • Napster
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  • PRISM C.O. / Webmaster / Admin
  • Have Fun! It's mandatory.
  • Posts: 3339
Nobli wrote:


Myself and the people I brought to the match, it was a great first match back since we haven't played with the EWA league in about 5 years. It was a blast for sure, still sore from how much running, diving and dragging people to safety as a medic. Think I revived well over 30 people, spent about as much time restocking bandages as I did using them.



I am glad you had a fun day. As a medic, what do you think about the number of medics available and the number of bandages you received? One of the things we are considering is raising the number of bandages per medic, or the number of medics on each faction.






Nobli wrote:


I do want to say something in regards to what you brought up with 2 and 3.

I did see a great deal of interruption but to be fair it wasn't entirely the fault of players. Several times the admins hosting the briefing would take a moment to talk amongst each other about what they were about to say to the crowd next. I don't think its fair to claim they were interrupting when the hosts of the event were not even addressing the crowd as a whole for relatively long spans of time. If you are going to begin punishing by means of expulsion from an event (with threat of not being refunded as well) then I would recommend not placing the beast of that burden on them. You can't expect a group of, what? Nearly 100 players? To just sit there while your briefing is still being figured out. I understand that clarified information is key, so discussing it to make sure the information you give the crowd is as accurate as possible. However, then claiming the crowd of rude interruption when you begin again after just spending several minutes leaving them in silence is not a fair expectation.



First, I want to say that the 4 things to improve I've addressed were a common theme given to me either in person or by PM after the game from players who I've asked what would have made the game better for them. They are coming from player feedback.

Second, I don't think it's an attitude conducive to improving things to discuss who to blame or who not to blame, it certainly isn't admins blaming players. Believe me, there is another list in a private chat for admins to improve, a much longer list, and much of it are specifically things that "I" could improve in hosting the next one.

In regards to point number 2, there were players talking while admins were talking, after repeated calls to pay attention, having side conversations. From the steps, I could point out individual offenders, but I would rather address it privately as I have been, including with members of my own team PRISM at this last Saturday's practice. Additionally, there were quite a few people who showed up late or as the briefing was starting, who needed to be put through registration as chrono in an efficient manner which allowed them to start the game with those who were on time. There were things out of my control which caused delays, and there were things in my control which caused delays, and we are addressing both in an admin chat in regards to things like the briefing, distribution of staff (I.E. more needed at registration table), and handling and verification of pre-payments and walk-on payments. Despite all of the behind-the-scenes logistics brought to admins during the briefing, there are indeed things we can improve on and are already discussing for next year. That being said, I must politely disagree, it is a COMPLETELY reasonable expectation that players not talk, play-shove each other, or throw BBs at each other, or walk to their cars to fill mags while the admins are actively speaking at a briefing, or even while reading raffle numbers or handing out the door prizes. And yes, there were some players doing these things from the very beginning of the briefing and ongoing throughout (again, WHILE admins were speaking, not during "pauses" as you mentioned, and in many cases it was the same players, most of whom have played with EWA and at Nitehawk many times before and felt that it was not important to hear the briefing, and it showed in number 3. I recommended the one-warning policy to the field owner for next Year's Walk the Line IV, and he chose to adopt it for ALL future games at Nitehawk. It hasn't been determined whether those penalized will be asked to leave for the rest of the day, or to be excluded from participation in only a portion. It will be up to the field owner in each case, and it is my hope that it never becomes necessary to enforce this, and that the warning simply works in convincing the offender to cease those actions. You are right, there were things the admins could have done a better as well in the briefing, and that is being addressed privately (we've already met and began planning for WTL IV in 2018), but the things that players can improve on must be addressed too, and this is us addressing it.

As for point number 3, medic rules were clearly established in the OP post itself, for each team, under Posted Games (link Here. They were again clearly explained during the briefing, some questions were asked (and answered), and then I asked if anybody had any other questions about the medic mechanic, and there were none. Despite this, I received multiple complaints from all teams that some players were going back to respawn individually when the established policy was call for medic, or the whole squad respawns if one isn't available and they have casualties. The expectation that the medic rule would be understood and followed is again, very reasonable once asked whether there are anymore questions on the medic segment of the briefing, and no more hands coming up with questions.




In conclusion, we generally keep these kinds of things behind the scenes as they are not the players' burden to deal with, but so that you understand the admins' point of view and some of the causes for the "delays" you mentioned, there were a few things that were very different in WTL III than the previous iterations (WTL I and II).

-New Field, WTL I and II was hosted by EWA and Team PRISM at the old Canopy Field in Neuman Lake, and Admission was free, raffle sponsored by Nitehawk. That field was logged, so we didn't have the event in 2016, and then arranged with Dale to host at Nitehawk field for a field fee. This brought with it some perks we didn't have available when it was free, like the jeep, the rocket launchers, hot lunch available on-site, battery charging stations, HPA fills (it was $5 for all day air, those who needed this service were very happy with the price), gun rentals, BBs for sale.

-No cell signal at the field (for most of us).

-Pre-payment as required by field owner, while we had pre-registration before, the pre-payment with an option to pay a higher fee on game day created its own set of challenges, even more so in verifying payment of players showing up late, as well as the initial set-up of accepting the payments, but not having access to the account to view them. We did what we could and I constantly bugged Dale with transaction numbers to verify, but things became a bit more complicated for those who were paying the very last two days before the game, as I and some of the other admins had already left to the field to camp and set things up the night before, and as I mentioned, no cell signal.

-Medic policy was completely re-created from scratch. We previously had one medic per fire team with a 15 or 30 second two-hand touch rule, which was changed to using the "bandages" and one medic per squad (cutting medics in half for DEA and Halcon Cartel, and by 2/3 on Los Burros Cartel).

-Sniper teams - this was the first time we established sniper teams independent of squads

-Many of us did not have a phone signal on the field. This created a few problems. For me personally, my battery was nearly drained the night before as my phone was searching for a signal before I realized it and set it to airplane mode, I relied heavily on my phone for the time and multiple timers for different objectives. I relied on some of my fellow CIA operatives for some of these tasks, and including some radio communication with team leaders.

-Players had a lot of side-questions about their own registrations, payments, roles, guns. We are already working on a better way to work with people who are not ready before the briefing.



Things we are considering for next year (not set in stone, feedback wanted)

1) Ramping up the milsim aspect.
Because it is a paid event on private property, with vehicle(s) available, it creates situations that are more easily handled than when we were hosting on state land with no field fee. One of the options, as Nitehawk is also a retailer, is to supply all BBs, and limit the amount of BBs on the field. It would have been fairly complicated to store everybody's BBs and deal with the possibility of people grabbing someone else's bag, but if Nitehawk can provide the BBs (except for snipers), this is something much easier to regulate. However this may incur roughly a $5 increase to the field fee.

In one example, it would look something like this:

Each player (except snipers) starts with ~500 BBs (honestly the number doesn't matter as long as it is consistent, whether it's 500 or 600 etc, we would use an identical small container which fits roughly 500-600 BBs to fill small sandwich bags. Those, we'll say 500 rounds for now are for the player to distribute how he or she wishes, whether over 2 high-caps or 4-5 midcaps for example. Support (LMG) would receive a higher initial BB pool of 2500. During the game, BBs would be rewarded for various things such as CIA-assigned tasks, found in high-traffic areas, or for completion of primary tasks as seen fit by admins, in addition to cocaine rewards. In one example, The CIA may offer a team the mission of neutralizing a rogue agent at a pre-determined location within a certain amount of time before he completes a wireless transmission (actual objective given to Los Burros in WTL III). As reward, in additional to the 5 cocaine, the CIA may give a large container (5,000) to the commanding officer to distribute among his team as he sees fit.

This would promote use of semi-automatic fire (except LMGs, although automatic fire is allowed but discouraged), as well as expose players to the very realistic scenario of having limited ammo and the need to conserve it, as well as put value on acquiring more whether through CIA rewards for missions completed or timed ammo-resupply. Additionally, this would create more depth in comradery in sharing BBs or magazines with teammates, and plays very well into the fact that each team is primarily lead by an established airsoft team from the region. As a side bonus, this would also decrease instances of over-shooting by reducing the volume of fire on the field.


2) Additions to the field
Dale has some building materials and plans on using them to create additional structures on the field, as well as touch up some of the older ones. There will be opportunities to assist in one or more build-days between now and Walk The Line IV in May 2018. There is a possibility in offering a discount for those who come out to help, to be determined by field owner.
Sabin
US Navy Veteran



EWA | Webmaster / Admin
Team PRISM | C.O.
-Everyone's favorite computer nerd-
Last Edit: 2 years ago by Napster.
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